Putin's media discussion
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Webster
Well-Known Member
My thoughts.... (1) who the hell is he to tell the West what to do with that missile defense system, a system which by its' very design would not stop a concerted Russian attack and (2) with all due respect, Mr. Putin, shouldn't it up to the peoples of Eastern & Central Europe to decide and not you, sir?
did the USA interfere with the missile system that the Soviet Union tried to put in place in Cuba back in 1962? What business of it was the USA to interfere in that?
Self defense? sure, absolutely of course they stepped in, who wouldn't.
and you don't think that Russia has self defense concerns about every NATO country around them building missile systems as the EU grows closer to Russia's boarders? Doesn't matter if you agree with it or not, what matters to world security is that Russia feels threatened and is prepared to defend itself if needed.
Seriously, do you really think that Russia, the country that was dragged into two world wars with the loss of 22 million people in WW2 alone, will sit back and do nothing while NATO surrounds it's boarders?
If you think he will just sit back and relax I hope you have stocked up on food supplies.
and to answer your questions, sure all those countries can do what they want to do, but just because they can, doesn't mean that they should.
Webster
Well-Known Member
Under the Monroe Doctrine, it was damn well our business at the time, especially given the missiles the former Soviet Union had there, some of which could reach as far as Chicago & Detroit? I mean, I know we Americans can be slow on the international uptake at times, but dude, once we knew those missiles were there, they were going to leave one way or the other....and the way we got the Soviets to take them out of Cuba was the classic way a country deals with a pathological bully: you use enough force (or the threat of using said force) as a card to play in the hopes that your opponents sees that your serious and steps back from the brink.
As to Eastern & Central Europe, Worldwide...
...what business is it of Russia's to tell its' neighbors what they can or can't do?
This is not the Cold War, where even the Soviets knew the "rules of the game" as they were, nor is the era of the Russian Tsars; you have sovereign countries - many of whom were formerly occupied by Russia at one point or another - that have made the clear and conscious decision to turn westward, to join with their Western Europe counterparts either as members of the EU or NATO (or both) and it pisses Vladimir Putin to no one because it means he can't re-create the former Eurasian sphere or influence that the former Soviet Union nor Tsarist Russia once had....so he has to do two things: (1) weaken Western Europe through covert means and (2) take territory from non-NATO/EU member states in the hopes that he can gauge what he thinks the West will do...
...well, I'm sorry, but if he thinks the West will back down in the East...he's got another thought coming; everything he does in that region, we can do to Russia elsewhere and there are a few things the West can do to express their displeasure towards Russia, but those are separate conversations for later.
"Was dragged"? 1939 SU entered the war in agreement with Nazi Germany, occupying then-independent Baltic countries, half of Poland and other areas and trying to occupy Finland. And in 1941 they were "dragged" only because Germany (and Finland) attacked first, Stalin had underestimated Hitler, assuming Germany wouldn't start two-front war and SU could re-enter the battle after Hitler and West had beat the crap out of each other.
I think Putin's argument that during Cold War both sides wanted to have balance of power to keep peace is absolute BS. Both USA and SU were all the time looking for an edge as they best could.
Note how he explains how Russia was 2000 in ruins and now it's practically a superpower - obviously thanks to himself.
He has some valid points, the missile defense system is kind of like putting troops by border (and NATO adding presence in Baltic is literally that), but IMO those are reasonable, fitting and what should've been expectable answer to Russia's actions in Ukraine.